tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post4329750641306815625..comments2023-10-30T08:40:59.016-04:00Comments on Wolfish Musings: Kosher "Cheese"burgersBrooklynWolfhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03994285019137108636noreply@blogger.comBlogger23125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-70927021962359962952007-12-27T09:08:00.000-05:002007-12-27T09:08:00.000-05:00Nothing to add, except that Ichabod Chrain is stil...Nothing to add, except that Ichabod Chrain is <I><B>still</B></I> the best Judeo-pseudonym around (with all due respect to the rest of you), and I still chortle unbecomingly whenever I see it.Michael Koplowhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07334251239196640565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-60025580419741012232007-12-26T21:46:00.000-05:002007-12-26T21:46:00.000-05:00I am lactose challenged as it might be more polite...I am lactose challenged as it might be more polite to say so real cheese and milk aren't for me. Meat is but I live nowhere near any kosher meat sources so I am still working on that. Soy products taste... eh... not great.<BR/><BR/>I read it said somewhere that while kashrut doesn't explicitly embrace vegetarianism, it certainly nudges that way. Maybe there's some veggie yet to be found that will taste more like meat, but I am slowly learning to do without it.<BR/><BR/>In the mean time, I do like rice, noodles, etc. Fish... no real need for cheeseburgers kosher or otherwise. As far as bacon bits go... I am shuddering to think of what might be in them-suitepotato-https://www.blogger.com/profile/04567987879881511630noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-90579990969531902922007-12-25T11:53:00.000-05:002007-12-25T11:53:00.000-05:00These "kosherized" foods do not really appeal to t...These "kosherized" foods do not really appeal to the baalei teshuva out there - we know how the stuff is supposed to taste and "soy cheese" and "Bacos" are not it! After becoming frum 25 years ago I would occasionally miss these types of foods, and I would try the "new" versions once, but I gave up on them quickly.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-33710166512906252092007-12-24T19:06:00.000-05:002007-12-24T19:06:00.000-05:00I can't believe how worked up people can get over ...I can't believe how worked up people can get over "kosherizing" everything. These same commentors who get worked up over a glatt kosher burger with fake cheese, will bend themselves into a pretzel to defend other unsavory behaviors.Orthonomicshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07892074485262548496noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-63451707468570587072007-12-23T23:38:00.000-05:002007-12-23T23:38:00.000-05:00A symbol of assimilation? What does that mean? Un...A symbol of assimilation? What does that mean? Until we know what it means, we can't tell what's wrong with it. <BR/><BR/>On the other hand, if it was Twinkies, then I could see it. That has a whole different ambiance.<BR/><BR/>Ichabod ChrainAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-6854831232948456022007-12-23T18:29:00.000-05:002007-12-23T18:29:00.000-05:00oreos were really disappointing. even those hydro...oreos were really disappointing. even those hydrox knockoffs were better.Steg (dos iz nit der šteg)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07694556690190505030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-90733281874899495952007-12-23T17:59:00.000-05:002007-12-23T17:59:00.000-05:00I knew a rabbi who banned Oreos after they became ...<I>I knew a rabbi who banned Oreos after they became kosher, claiming that they were the ultimate symbol of assimilation. </I><BR/><BR/>Oreos are a greater symbol of assimilation than, say, a Hannukah bush?? <BR/><BR/>Sorry, but someone needs to set your rabbi straight.<BR/><BR/>The WolfBrooklynWolfhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03994285019137108636noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-16997519335009129132007-12-23T17:48:00.000-05:002007-12-23T17:48:00.000-05:00I agree with your rabbi, anonymous; kosher Oreos a...I agree with your rabbi, anonymous; kosher Oreos are just WRONG!PsychoToddlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00874353280798371891noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-68421594250445065492007-12-22T23:03:00.000-05:002007-12-22T23:03:00.000-05:00I knew a rabbi who banned Oreos after they became ...I knew a rabbi who banned Oreos after they became kosher, claiming that they were the ultimate symbol of assimilation. I asked him if he was planning to ban the shul kosher pizza fund-raisers as well. We don't speak anymore ;-)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-1834052783933860762007-12-22T22:01:00.000-05:002007-12-22T22:01:00.000-05:00kendra:kosher venison is available on the market.kendra:<BR/><BR/>kosher venison is available on the market.Steg (dos iz nit der šteg)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07694556690190505030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-83704629970620937212007-12-21T13:22:00.000-05:002007-12-21T13:22:00.000-05:00I thought wild animals might as well not be kosher...I thought wild animals might as well not be kosher because you can't do the proper ritual slaughtering on them? So doesn't that point supercede the milk/meat issue, or it's one of those "who knows _how_ you'd do it, but if you did, this is the principle" things?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-5178337766250847852007-12-21T13:10:00.000-05:002007-12-21T13:10:00.000-05:00Woodrow:No. Eating, cooking, or deriving benefit ...Woodrow:<BR/><BR/>No. Eating, cooking, or deriving benefit from a mixture of the meat of domesticated kosher animals and the milk of kosher animals is biblically forbidden by all sources.<BR/><BR/>Rabbinic extensions include adding the flesh of kosher wild animals and kosher poultry to the list. Rabbi Akiva holds that those are also biblical, but we don't hold like him.<BR/><BR/>I have no idea whether the rabbis extended the prohibition to the milk of wild kosher animals. I suspect so, just for completeness. :>)Larry Lennhoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06578073969473815180noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-28789394374517590822007-12-21T11:13:00.000-05:002007-12-21T11:13:00.000-05:00Just to be picky- isn't the original Biblical proh...Just to be picky- isn't the original Biblical prohibition to COOK with meat and milk? I thought the prohibition of eating them together was just a rabbinic fence.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-37608526256139657882007-12-21T08:35:00.000-05:002007-12-21T08:35:00.000-05:00Great break down of the issue.Great break down of the issue.Jacob Da Jewhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15181930948956094882noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-23683564712490034302007-12-20T11:24:00.000-05:002007-12-20T11:24:00.000-05:00when i was in maryland a few years ago, i was amaz...when i was in maryland a few years ago, i was amazed at how every kosher dairy place (pizza, etc.) had some kind of parva fake "meat" -- veggieroni pizza, tofu-based "beef" burritos, etc.<BR/><BR/>unfortunately, there are way too many uptight people here in NYC to be able to have such things (exhibit 1: the kosher subway in Brooklyn which is proud of the fact that unlike other ones, they have no parva "cheese") so i have to make my "chicken" quesadillas and cheesy-"meaty"-pasta all at home.<BR/><BR/>the first time i walked into a kosher pizza place in Manhattan that had fake "pepperoni" (which, unfortunately wasn't nearly as good as <A HREF="http://www.oldcitycafe.us/pizzas.asp" REL="nofollow">theseguys</A>' vegeroni), i personally called up the <I>rav hamakhshir</I> and left a message on his voicemail thanking him for being sensibleSteg (dos iz nit der šteg)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07694556690190505030noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-46269191348439319862007-12-20T10:39:00.000-05:002007-12-20T10:39:00.000-05:00I was following your points for the most part, Wol...I was following your points for the most part, Wolf, until you got to the part of talking about the behavior that is associated with the action of eating a cheeseburger. <BR/><BR/>Is it that you mean that people who eat non-kosher foods like cheeseburgers eat them in a way that's inappropriate? Prust? Piggish? <BR/><BR/>Sounds to me like a description of just about every shul kiddush, wedding smorgasbord, and (I imagine) those 24-hour tearoom fress-fests that they have at things like Pesach hotels. <BR/><BR/>Before we got married, my husband would work as a mashgiach's assistant at those hotels as he had no other place to be for Pesach. He later told me stories from those jobs about grown men ransacking the children's early 4 p.m. dinner, after just getting up from lunch, tearoom, snack, and about 2 hours before the next meal would begin. Fighting, shoving, pushing people aside, and acting like, well, pigs. <BR/><BR/>When it comes to negative behavior associated with food, I think it's safe to say that many frum Jews have a monopoly on that. I know that there's an issue of treif food having a negative effect on a person's neshama, but as for "the behavior associated with a person who eats a cheeseburger," I can't agree.RaggedyMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01022064984702182705noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-48778036489626987832007-12-20T09:44:00.000-05:002007-12-20T09:44:00.000-05:00I also think fake cheese is gross...however real c...I also think fake cheese is gross...however real cheese on a veggie burger is really *good*!<BR/><BR/>BTW, when I was a kid my folks used to take us to an Italian restaurant (on Union Turnpike--I think it's still there) for veal parmesan all the time. One day a neighbor told us that a kosher pizza place on Main Street started to serve Eggplant Parmesan. We never went back to the Italian place again.PsychoToddlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00874353280798371891noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-1842024743128331512007-12-20T05:09:00.000-05:002007-12-20T05:09:00.000-05:00I wonder if any of the people who have a problem w...I wonder if any of the people who have a problem with it use the Kosher for Pesach 'pasta'...Pesky Settlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03077745747562609723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-75980859730450577982007-12-20T03:25:00.000-05:002007-12-20T03:25:00.000-05:00Of course, they'll argue back that their mystic st...Of course, they'll argue back that their mystic stuff _clearly explains_ the spirit of the Law. After all, Hashem would not leave us unable to see how the mitzvah is supposed to be applied in general? And if you can't use the mystic stuff then there's a problem with you. This is why you have to listen to someone who says their mystic stuff works.<BR/><BR/>At this point I mention the ayin marit regarding divination arising from their behaviour and walk away in serious vexation. And this is one of my profound sorrows is the sort of person who sincerely believes that is becoming more and more representitive of Torah bound Judaism. I can accept a mystical Jew; a mystical Jew often cannot accept me.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-21787250437250242762007-12-20T01:25:00.000-05:002007-12-20T01:25:00.000-05:00Personally I find most fake cheese gross, but some...Personally I find most fake cheese gross, but some of the fake meat burgers can be quite good. When I was first keeping kosher I used to eat veggie burgers with cheese a lot.Zach Kessinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04276155117746098546noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-53899000991861773762007-12-19T23:03:00.000-05:002007-12-19T23:03:00.000-05:00as i read the post i was thinking that these peopl...as i read the post i was thinking that these people are just plain [. . .]. i wasn't going to actually leave that comment. but since PT already did, i must be in good company and i can can do so as well. i think the whole issue is stupid.<BR/><BR/>according to this logic, most restaraunts should shut down and most packaged foods should lose their hechsher.<BR/><BR/>i would also like know then how it is that differnt types of jews have such different culinary habits.<BR/><BR/>anyway, this is not a new issue. i remember when dunkin donoughts first became kosher they served "kosher" bacon, ham and sausage. other restaurants have done the same over the years.<BR/><BR/>as far as KFC in israel (which i think has since closed down), we get a kick out of going to these places when we are there. esp. since in israel the american franchses are actually decent (except dominoes), as opposed to the few attempts to open them here in america (the nathans and subway in brookln were/are horrible).<BR/><BR/>all this having been said, i do personally find the idea of mixing milk and meat gross. even i were to become non-religious, i don't think i could ever bring myself to try a cheesburger.Lion of Zionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10342299133387602141noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-21727434841711587432007-12-19T17:44:00.000-05:002007-12-19T17:44:00.000-05:00The Gemara quotes an insight of Yalta, the wife of...The Gemara quotes an insight of Yalta, the wife of Rav Nachman: "whatever the Merciful One forbade us, He permitted us something corresponding. He forbade us blood, but permitted us liver He forbade eating the chelev of a domestic animal, but permitted chelev of an undomesticated animal, He forbade pork but permitted the brains of a shibuta (a type of fish) " (Chullin 109b). Hashem does not wish to deprive us of any worldly pleasures. All pleasures may be obtained by forbidden or permitted means. <BR/><BR/>Source: <A HREF="http://www.yna.edu/torah/wx-display.php?id=7082613439&fn=p_ne67vshl.html&search=" REL="nofollow">Rav Avigdor Nebezahl</A>Larry Lennhoffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06578073969473815180noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-11425059.post-37457197681783956792007-12-19T16:22:00.000-05:002007-12-19T16:22:00.000-05:00I think the whole issue is stupid. If it's not tr...I think the whole issue is stupid. If it's not treif, you can eat it.<BR/><BR/>Maybe the argument is that it shows there's something wrong with us for developing a taivah for non-kosher food. Whatever.<BR/><BR/>Who hasn't walked past an Arby's in the parking lot of a mall and smelled that glorious smell and thought "man, I wish I could eat that." I have actually felt guilty about smelling it because the act of smelling involves ingesting small amounts of the material that float through the air.<BR/><BR/>But the whole issue is narishkeit. If we're not supposed to eat food that is similar looking to treif food, then close all the kosher pizza places because REAL pizza is not of Jewish origin and is TREIF!<BR/><BR/>Close the chinese places too. While you're at it, stop buying hot dogs and hamburgers, because those were invented by goyim too.<BR/><BR/>And if you're not going to close those places, just make sure you never order eggplant parmesan, because it's pretty clear that's a substitute for veal parmesan, which I can tell you from experience, is REALLY treif.<BR/><BR/>Enjoy your baco bits.PsychoToddlerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00874353280798371891noreply@blogger.com